ESA Canada boss on 2024 gaming highlights, potential Trump impact on Canadian industry

It’s quite an interesting time for Paul Fogolin.

For six years, the Vaughan, Ontario native served as the vice president of policy and government affairs at the Entertainment Software Association of Canada (ESAC), the lobbying group that represents Canada’s $5.5 billion gaming industry. It was an impressive tenure that ended in April when he left the organization to lead the Canadian Association of Recycling. However, he’s now returned to his old company to succeed Jayson Hilchie, the former president and CEO who departed ESAC after 12 years.

“As soon as this opportunity presented itself, it was like coming home, and I couldn’t be happier,” Fogolin tells MobileSyrup during his first week in the executive role earlier this month. But of course, he’s not new to ESAC as a whole, and he says he’s not planning to “reinvent the wheel” from what the group has already been doing. “It’s right on our website: ‘We protect and promote the video game industry in Canada.’ And that’ll continue to be the focus,” he explains.

On top of that, he says he’s joining ESAC at a rather “unique time” in that the organization just turned 20 years old in October, mere weeks before he started. Given the change in leadership, however, he says ESAC is planning some anniversary initiatives next year to promote the history of the broader Canadian gaming industry.

“Not only would we look to highlight current Canadian games, but maybe a little bit of a look back into the past. Some of the Canadian games that have made an impact on players all over the world have such a cool story to tell. We’re a forward-looking industry, constantly evolving, but we’re maturing,” he says. “The games industry has been around since, depending on who you ask, ‘the 70s, ’80s, but we’re not the nascent industry we once were. And so we’re starting to develop, in addition to cutting-edge technology going forward, a historical legacy, and Canada is a part of that. So I think there are some some neat opportunities there.”

He says he can’t yet get into further details about these plans, but it’s easy to imagine what some of them could include. For one, publishing giant Ubisoft recently celebrated its 25th anniversary in Canada, where many of its biggest games — including Assassin’s Creed, Far Cry and Splinter Cell — have been developed. Going back even further, Behaviour Interactive, Canada’s largest independent developer and the studio behind the massively popular Dead by Daylight, has been in business for over 30 years. And looking ahead, BioWare Edmonton, arguably Canada’s most iconic developer thanks to its work on the likes of Baldur’s Gate, Star Wars, Mass Effect and Dragon Age, will turn 30 next February.

“I think it coincides nicely with my arrival in this role to do some exciting things to highlight the industry,” Fogolin says of ESAC’s anniversary plans. “I fully intend to get back across Canada, re-engage with members — not only our members, but also some of the indie community that we work closely with as well — and continue to do everything we can to serve the industry.”

Ubisoft Montreal. (Image credit: Flickr — Shuichi Aizawa)

As Fogolin talks about his general goals for ESAC, I’m reminded of my many conversations with Hilchie over the years in which the former ESAC executive and Coldbrook, Nova Scotia native talked about a personal desire to uplift developers in the Maritimes. With that in mind, I ask Fogolin if there are any particular parts of the Canadian gaming industry that are similarly near and dear to his heart that he’d like to promote.

“One of the things I’ve been saying in the previous [ESAC] role, especially when I would talk to government: this a coast-to-coast industry. Obviously, there’s a huge concentration in Quebec, Vancouver and the greater B.C. area. But there really is, not only in the Maritimes, stories to tell across the country. And so I’d like to continue to build upon that. And then beyond that, I’m going to be actively looking, working with my team, working with members, to look at ways to tap into the passionate player base,” he said.

Fogolin notes that ESAC has done that in the past to a degree through studies that promote Canadian games in terms of their economic impact, benefits on everyday players, contributions to external sectors like healthcare and education and more, which it will continue to do. (He teases that a new Canadian gaming industry economic impact report is coming in the new year.) But he also wants to take all of that even further. “Here in Canada, we have some really passionate and successful creators. And so I think there’s some opportunities there to find synergies between the development side, the publishing side, and the player community and the broader sort of industry surrounding games,” he says. “My intent is that it helps the industry and it helps get out a positive message.”

The potential impact of the next U.S. government

The start of Fogolin’s role as ESAC boss also came mere days after Donald Trump won the U.S. presidential election. Naturally, there’s been a lot of speculation about the many implications of a Trump presidency, especially regarding his staunch “America First” policies that could threaten partnerships with other countries. So, that begs the question: while it’s still early, what impact might the looming Trump administration have on the Canadian gaming industry?

Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau with former U.S. President Donald Trump. (Image credit: Government of Canada)

“The short answer is: nobody really knows at this point,” Fogolin admits. “But I can tell you two things. One is, I was on a call with the global CEOs on Tuesday and Stan Pierre-Louis, who’s the ESA CEO, started off by telling us about what he thinks about the election. And they are very prepared, and have been preparing, for a potential Trump administration, and how they’ll approach making sure the industry is at the table, that they’re positioning correctly. And so that’s a great partner to work with from a Canadian perspective.”

He adds that ESAC will always be able to lean on its “great relationships” in Ottawa to continue to support the Canadian gaming space. “And so if and when something does happen that could impact the industry, the Canadian industry in particular — notwithstanding some of the headlines you’ve seen about potential console price increases, if they’re developed in Asia and other markets — we will be at the table right away to voice our concerns and work through the Canadian officials to make sure that our industry perspective is heard. And of course, every industry potentially could be impacted,” he says.

To that point, he says he wants to continue expanding ESAC’s reach into other sectors to strengthen its foreign presence and build relationships with non-gaming companies.

“One of the things that I championed in the last five, six years was expanding thought leadership. So we joined things like the C.D. Howe Institute and Public Policy Forum, and some of our members were like, ‘Well, how’s this helping?’ But the truth is, when you are at events with other stakeholders from the auto industry and from other tech sectors, it elevates your credibility, and it gives you opportunities to build relationships and tell your story,” he explains. “So I’m going to be looking for more opportunities to get out there, to get our brand out, to get our message out, so that, if and when things happen from a policy perspective, we need to intervene, we are there.”

It was a pleasure meeting Minister @PascaleStOnge_ with our members to discuss how the Canadian video game industry is keeping players safe online. @PMFogolin #cdnpoli pic.twitter.com/DSj80A83rQ

— ESACanada (@ESACanada) October 26, 2023

Finally, he says the ESAC has strong relationships with the other global trade associations who can all work together to mitigate any policy issues. “Because this is such a global industry, a lot of the issues that face the Canadian industry are shared,” he says. “Some things are unique, but so many are shared, so we’re constantly finding ways to work with others, to see what’s happening in their jurisdictions, what’s happening here, and help each other navigate challenges and also look for some opportunities.”

Of course, even without Trump, the gaming industry has been in a turbulent period due to a slew of layoffs across the board. Nearly 25,000 developers are estimated to have lost their jobs throughout 2023 and 2024, as tracked by Riot Games technical artist Farhan Noor. When asked whether this will improve in 2025, Folgin first acknowledges that it’s been a “tough” couple of years in that regard.

“One job loss is one too many. It’s just always difficult. These are people, these are lives, these are families, and these are excellent creators and talents. I don’t speak for any particular member, but I just know that these decisions are always taken seriously,” he says. “But what we’ve seen happen in the post-pandemic realignment, let’s call it — as the pandemic happened and [there was] an increase in demand and more people staying home, studios adjusted to meet that demand. And then we’ve seen, at the same time, massive restructuring. You had Xbox with the purchase of Activision Blizzard, all sorts of things happening. So I think we’ve seen a market correction — it has slowed down, the level of job losses that we’ve seen. I hope that’s the case next year. And I can say, based on what I’ve seen and heard from members, it’s in a much better place than it has been.”

2024 highlights heading into the new year

Fogolin rejoining the ESAC near the end of the year means quite a lot has happened since he was last with the company. When asked what are some of his big takeaways from 2024, he first points to BioWare Edmonton’s recently released Dragon Age: The Veilguard. “On a personal level, and also from an ESAC perspective, I’m thrilled to see what they did with that game,” he says. “There was a long lead-up to it, and a lot of challenges in the development process, but it’s great to see that. I mean, Edmonton, BioWare, that studio, there’s so much history.”

Dragon Age: The Veilguard. (Image credit: EA)

Another game on his personal list is Quebec City-based Sabotage‘s Sea of Stars, the award-winning 2023 RPG which just released a big free update that adds three-player co-op. (Also announced after our interview — the game has reached six million players, which is no small feat for any game, let alone an indie one.) He also shouts out recent coverage that I and other media did for South of Midnight from Montreal’s Compulsion Games, which follows a young Black woman on a journey through a fantastical version of the American Deep South.

“The industry is just constantly evolving […] Obviously, there are iterative [releases] — you have your [EA Sports FCs] that come out every year, you have your NHLs. And those are fantastic games and products that are always at the top of the sales lists that come out of Burnaby [from EA Vancouver]. But you are going to see, like I said, Compulsion Games, you’re going to see some exciting new IP and things happening. And I think there’s also a lot of exciting things that are going to continue to happen on the indie scene with hits coming out and [different] creative perspectives. Because this is a diverse country with a lot of different perspectives, and those perspectives are shown through storytelling and how games are made and what influences them. And I think we’re going to continue to see that in new and creative ways.”

To that point, he cites a feature that I recently put together on 1000xResist, a high-concept sci-fi narrative adventure game about the Asian diaspora from first-time Vancouver developer Sunset Visitor. It’s one of the most acclaimed games of the year, with many players advocating for it to get several nominations at The Game Awards, which were revealed just a few days after my chat with Fogolin. Unfortunately, 1000xResist was snubbed, although it got significant attention in the inaugural Indie Game Awards through Best Narrative and Game of the Year nominations. (Disclaimer: MobileSyrup is one of over 130 global media outlets on The Game Awards voting jury.)

But something The Game Awards jury did recognize, however, was Balatro, a game made by an anonymous Canadian developer who goes by the name of ‘LocalThunk.’ Impressively, it’s one of the six titles up for the coveted Game of the Year. The fact that this poker-inspired card game from a lone Canadian is competing with the likes of a Final Fantasy VII sequel, the Persona spiritual successor Metaphor: ReFantazio and a massive expansion to the 2022 Game Awards GOTY winner Elden Ring speaks to the talent and creativity of our national game sector.

Canadian-made Balatro is the smash hit indie game of the year. (Image credit: Playstack)

And beyond any particular titles, Fogolin notes that the growing variety of platforms on the market — from traditional hardware like consoles, PC and mobile to such newer offerings as cloud gaming and PC gaming handhelds like the Steam Deck — will only give Canadian developers even more options to work with. “I think the way players play is constantly evolving and I know our members are just going to find ways to create compelling games that can be played by a diverse audience wherever they want to play them,” he says, adding that Nintendo is also expected to release a successor to the Switch next year.

“There’s a lot of exciting things happening […] We’ve brought on a bunch of new members in the last, I’d say, year or so. Of course, our founding members, [like] EA, Ubisoft [and] Nintendo, are integral part of what we do. But we have a new suite of members, like Epic and Tencent and others. The industry grows and their interest in the Canadian market is strong […] Canadian made games, and Canada as a destination to make games, will continue to be attractive for all sorts of publishers, developers and companies around the world.”

This interview has been edited for language and clarity.

Image credit: EA/Playstack/White House